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Hey everybody, welcome to the Private Club Radio Show, where we give you the scoop on all things private golf and country clubs, from mastering leadership and management, food and beverage excellence, member engagement secrets, board governance and everything in between, all while keeping it fun and light.
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Whether you're a club veteran just getting your feet wet or somewhere in the middle, you are in the right place.
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I'm your host, denny Corby.
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Welcome to the show.
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You know that one member at your club who just doesn't fit, the one that everybody quietly avoids, or the one who somehow turns every event into their own drama.
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Now imagine if you can spot that person before they even get into the club, before they even get a member number.
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That's what this episode is about.
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I am thrilled to be bringing on Dan Klemek from Kennis Member Vetting.
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His team digs into the past and they dig past the polished applications, they dig past the handshakes, they dig past the glowing references and they find out who is really trying to join your club.
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And sometimes the stuff that they find will just absolutely blow your mind.
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And in this conversation, in this episode, we get into the biggest trends that Dan and their team is seeing right now, from pandemic PPP loan frauds that are still surfacing and now coming up a lot more.
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And we're not just go in, it's not just the obvious you know the guy who bought the Ferraris, you know but it goes beyond that.
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We dive into politics, which is now more polarized and loud than ever, with online posts that can clash hard with your club's culture.
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And, even more importantly, these so-called ghost accounts, which we've talked about here.
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We're going to talk about them a little bit more.
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And these are the profiles in these niche forum people that people think are never going to be found.
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And guess what?
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Kenes member vetting can find these profiles.
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And it's not just the large clubs and these big clubs that are doing this.
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A lot of smaller clubs are taking their vetting a lot more serious now.
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They're getting a lot more thorough, if not more, than some of these bigger clubs, because it's important and they realize how important every single new member is to the club, and one bad egg can really do some damage, especially some clubs that are doing these membership drives, which can be a minefield when you're bringing in dozens and dozens of brand new members in a month or two all at once.
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So if you ever wondered what's really possible when you pull back the curtain on an applicant, or how past behaviors predict future behavior inside your clubhouse.
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This episode is for you.
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If you and your club are not doing the vetting that you think it should be done, or if you're open or want to do maybe a little bit more member vetting, please head on over to membervettingcom.
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Fill out the form.
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Dan Paul or someone from the team will get in touch with you.
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Even if you want to see one of these sample reports of what they find on applicants, head on over to membervettingcom.
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Reach out, get one of these reports.
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You're going to be mind.
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It's unbelievable the stuff that they can uncover.
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So I am so stoked for this one.
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Private Club Radio listeners, let's welcome back to the show Dan Klemek.
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The analogy is that generally, you never know how many layers deep someone goes right.
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You have the surface layer that they introduced to you and that you see on the outside, but as we start peeling those layers back and looking at the background, looking at the history, looking at the things that we can find online, it can be endless.
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I mean, some of these accounts go very, very deep and very far back and are fairly well hidden.
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When we get to them, you go this was 10 layers deep.
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I don't know that we necessarily call it that, but that's kind of what it feels like.
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So that analogy has worked for a long time because, it's very true, you never know what you're going to get when you start feeling the layers back.
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Yeah, yeah, what's the average amount of layers that you peel, or normal?
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What's the normal?
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You know, your average person has what they display to the public professionally.
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Generally that's layer layer one and that's what they want you to see.
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Then there's the family layer.
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When you start getting into the personal accounts and then from there, if they are someone that has secondary accounts let's say their social media accounts twitter x, instagram, tiktok, all the good ones if they start having those secondary accounts, those tend to layer and spin off really quickly.
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Because if you find a secondary account that's into this one focus area whether it's political or it's some other weird lifestyle thing that they're into those tend to lead to other layers where like, okay, now we know what you're into, now we know to look over here, because you mentioned something over here and it's just keep going and going and going until you get to the bottom of it.
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But listen, your average member is two layers deep and it's their professionals, their family, they seem to match up and they're good people.
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It's the ones that you catch where you're like well, we just found something very unusual and we have a long way to go to figure this one out.
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We're midway through 2026.
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Has there been any?
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I know, I know I feel like the beginning was super slow and all of a sudden it was like hi, summer, but as we're in the 2026, has there been any common?
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The thing is not the word, but has there been anything that you guys have been finding more common now, or maybe into 2026, maybe even the past year or so, that maybe hasn't been common in the past?
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You're like oh, this has been coming up a lot, or like, or we've been seeing a lot more like.
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So in my head I'm thinking now like I don't ask why, but I get sucked down the YouTube rabbit hole of like random stuff and one of the things I enjoy listening to is like body cam footage and like I don't I don't know why with doing stuff, it's just like background noise, uh, but like, so I I've seen a lot of like the covid pandemic, the checks and the money.
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There's a lot of like, a lot of that fraud's coming up now.
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Has that been?
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has that been a thing that's been common and, like what else, has been popping up three things come to mind, and and two of them are are, you know, investigation related one.
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You hit the nail on the head.
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So the governments both uh, you know, the state and the federal government are finally catching up on COVID relief dollars.
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So that those PPP loans there are investigations going on in every state and every county on people that took those loans out for non-existent businesses or businesses that they started in order to get that loan money.
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So you're seeing a lot of people who have these PPP loan fraud cases.
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Now we have seen a lot of those where it's like okay, you know, in 2019, you had two employees, but all of a sudden, for the PPP loan, you're claiming 25 employees.
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You took a $2 million loan out.
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Now the government's going.
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What did you do with that?
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Because the business doesn't seem to exist.
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So, yeah, that is a huge theme.
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The other theme, and I think since we talked last, is political Things.
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The politics have, you know, wherever you're at, they've shifted.
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They've gone far left, far right.
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That has created some online, some heated online content that we find, and you know, I mean, let's face it Some of those people, no matter what side they're on, can be difficult to be around right, and so when they're posting these things online, the political posts have gone through the roof.
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I mean, people have taken sides and the ones that are vocal are loud and vocal and, again, not sometimes the best members, or at least somebody you should be aware of.
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Depending on what your club's culture is like, sometimes that's not a great fit.
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So that's what we've seen.
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Those would be the two main things in the past year.
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I mean, listen, the ghost accounts are crazy.
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I mean, when you find them, denny, you wouldn't believe.
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I mean, you could meet someone, have dinner with them, play around a golf with them, and they're totally normal.
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You'd hang out with them, you'd have beers with them, and then you would look at this report and go, oh my gosh, they're into that, that is something that they're into and it will eventually come up when they're members.
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I mean those those types of things that we find we'll just leave it at, strange lifestyle choices, uh, outside of the public view, but that tend to make their way online.
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There are forums, there are groups, there are things that people belong to that you would never believe, right?
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Mark the ceo, you're like cool guy had beers with him yesterday.
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He shot a 78.
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It was fun.
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And then you're like we should admit him.
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And then you look at our report.
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You go oh my gosh, oh my gosh he's a no, it's called furry denny.
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Furries, oh damn it.
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Come on, you knew that um.
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You knew that you found my account.
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You found my account, the animal in the background there and now okay listen, listen okay you're.
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You're furry curious, so, okay, time out.
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These are all things.
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So these are some just books I like and this is stuff from like shows and and just stuff.
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This was so look, if you get all defensive now, no, that was actually a.
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Very curious, very curious.
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I was doing a club show in Florida and they said hey, what do you want in your green room?
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So to me I don't take anything serious.
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I was like bottle of vodka, bottle of wine, a charcuterie board, puppies.
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I just started listing off all this stuff and, sure enough, when I, when I got into like the green room, there was like the stuffed animal dog, there was like small, like nips of vodka, there was like a charcuterie, but it was really funny uh, just like, whatever the rolling stones get, I want that uh, well, and then actually total side note.
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Do you know where the green m&ms came from or why that started?
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I do not so I don't know if it was the rolling stones one of the bands in in the writer said, uh, a bowl of green m&ms.
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And now, mind you, this was.
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This was back 80s, 90s maybe, and they did that for a very specific reason.
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There are people who put stuff in there in their rider for like bs, just just because they want it, but that was the tour manager.
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Because the tour manager put that on there, because if they showed up, because back in the day you couldn't just buy green m&ms, like now you can just buy the colors, as is like a whole bag of whatever I've been to vegas, I know yeah, so they did that because if the tour manager went into the green room when they first showed up and there was a bowl of green m&ms, that means that they had somebody read the rider.
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They had somebody sit there and separate all the m&ms, just to put the green one.
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So now they know it's probably going to be a safer venue.
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Everything's going to be set up properly.
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Like it, that was like, that was their little like trigger yeah, that was their like little trigger to go like, because now if he shows up and it's just a regular bull, it's like gosh.
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I really got to go and let me double check this, let me make sure all that.
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So I thought that was.
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It's like in college when you sneak a bizarre sentence into your essay just to see if the professor reads it.
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You got a 30-page essay and you sneak a sentence in there like this professor's awful, and then you wait to see if he says anything, because then you know he didn't read it.
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So, yeah, no, that's no.
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So the furry thing is very real and you know you can use your imagination as to what else there is out there, outside of the furry realm.
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But once you find something like that and I'll give you a more mundane example, more mundane example If I find out that you're a big car person, you have a whole bunch of pictures of your, you know pick a car.
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You know we're going racing in a few weeks BMW, for example.
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There are entire forums and cultures and websites and things dedicated to that.
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So I now know that about you.
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And then I start down that rabbit hole and I want to see are we street racing?
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Are we doing things nefariously?
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Who are we hanging out with?
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What kind of clubs and what kind of places do we go to?
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Because that leads to other things too and it leads to connections.
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It leads to things that you do and that's pretty mundane.
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I mean most car people are.
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I've got a.
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I've got a Wrangler.
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I'm on Wrangler forums because it's a, it's a nineties Wrangler, so trying to keep that thing alive and running is you need the forums, right?
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So there are things that you know people are into as hobbies and you find those things and you go down that rabbit hole and figure out what those really mean.
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Sometimes those hobbies are questionable at best.
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And then you, you know, you go down those, those rabbit holes and those sites and those forums and those things that are not traditionally found on Google.
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I mean, you know we joke all the time we talk about the analogy of the onion, but the iceberg right, and I've got a great picture of it somewhere where you've got this iceberg, where you've got just the tippy top showing on the surface, that's Google.
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Google only indexes about 5% to 6% of the entire internet.
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So that other 95% call it is not indexed by Google.
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So your average person isn't going to find those things, and that includes things like forums and other strange sites that are considered on.
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I would say the deep web would be the best way to describe it.
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But it's that, under the surface information that we dredge up and find where all of this information is.
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So that's really the benefit is finding all of it and going back to our trends.
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So we have the political, we've got the weird alternative lifestyle stuff, and the PPP loans are a big one.
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I mean they speak to a lot of fraud.
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I mean generally, when you see those, it means whatever that person's primary business was was failing or had a problem, and there's lawsuits and litigation and that was a way to get some quick cash infused into a business where it wasn't necessarily legitimate.
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And then you have the crazy ones where it's like you know, guy who claimed 30 employees and bought two Ferraris over COVID with PPP money.
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Well, that's a more obvious one.
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Those people were found first.
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Now they're going after the ones that are more questionable, like did you really have 100 employees and need a $10 million PPP loan, or maybe it was that inflated and they're going back and getting those things.
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The third trend is more business related.
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On our end is that we have seen a lot more small clubs contacting us, and when I say small, I mean by actual number of members, but also from a cost standpoint.
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Those clubs are contacting us more regularly and finding value in what we're doing because they are smaller.
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So we kind of had a target range of the type of club that was a good fit for us originally and being new to the industry only a couple of years ago a few years ago trying to learn things on the fly.
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But now we're finding that some of these smaller clubs are just as interested and so we're able to put together really nice packages for them too that are a little bit more cost conscious but still give them a much more in-depth view of what that applicant's going to be like.
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And the other going along with that is membership drives, which was something that I had never heard of before.
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But sometimes clubs will do membership drives.
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So they'll say you know, for the month of July we're going to try to sign up 100 new members and we're going to publish stuff and advertise.
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And what that turns out to be is 100 new members that no one knows they know nothing about, right.
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So we've got 100 members of the general public that no one has referred.
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They're just people that applied, and now we really feel like we're under the gun to get more information about these people before we admit them in.
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So those are just some of the biggest trends that I've seen over the last year, year and a half thing before we connected and chatted, you know, with paul, like years ago, and just a story of how you know the whole thing just came about when he, the a club that he was a member of, um asked like hey, with your business, can you do this for us?
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And like, and when he was telling me that I just assumed most clubs did a more thorough background, which to me is mind-blowing.
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It is, and so the two things that we run into the most are clubs that don't do anything right.
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They say, well, we've met the person, they must be great.
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But my story of meeting someone and playing golf with them doesn't always apply, because there are some strange things in the background and the other clubs are doing what you would consider a pre-employment background check if you were to get a job.
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And they run a background check, which the boring part of what I have to do is explain the difference, and that is the pre-employment background check is so heavily regulated by the FCRA because it's an offer of employment, so you can only look at this much of the person's background legally before you make a hiring decision.
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With private members there's no protections there.
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You can look at whatever you want to.
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We get to do our act.
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What we can actually do in our wheelhouses is dig really, really deep.
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So you had also mentioned the body cam footage.
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I would mention that to you because you know body cam footage is.
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You know, let's say, body cam footage is about 10 years old and the technology of police departments using them Almost every department now has them.
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I'm sure there's smaller departments over the country that don't, but most police departments have these.
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They are public record by and large.
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There's a couple of states that have issues where they don't consider them public record or they're harder to get, but by and large, they're public records.
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The example I always give is somebody with a DUI arrest.
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Right, let's say it's a 2018 DUI arrest and you look at that on paper and you say, okay, dui arrest, they did 30 hours of community service and that was it.
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That's the last number.
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Right, most of us know somebody that's had a DUI arrest.
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Let's face it and we say, okay, that's a normal guy problem, normal person problem.
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Looks like they moved on, no big deal.
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The question is, when you get that body cam footage and they're absolutely insane and they have to be tased and thrown in the back of the police car and all they want to talk about is how important they are and who they are and who they know and how awful the cops are and I pay your salary when that's on video.
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That's a different person than your buddy jim that just had one too many and drove home and got caught got caught and just took his punishment, moved on versus somebody that went absolutely bananas when they were intoxicated.
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So those are two different member types and that's the depth and the detail and the level that we give you.
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So the body camphor is just easier to get, it's faster to get and it's pretty much a standard practice when we have something like that.
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That's happened in the recent past because it can give you a lot of insight into who that person is.
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If they sit quiet, they think they take their time and they're just a normal guy that had a bad day, totally normal stuff, and the club gets to look at that and decide if that's the right personality, the right fit for them.
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So yeah, body cam footage is awesome and it's come a long way in the last 10 years, even in the last couple of years, I think know where we are in Metro Detroit almost every single department has it and DPD was like the last to adopt it, but now that they have it, it's been a really, really good tool for us.
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So that's a really nice feature to have.
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And I've said this before too, and it's not up to you, you don't decide who comes in, the club still decides all that.
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You just present all the fact.
00:18:25.559 --> 00:18:39.541
You just give all the information, just all the findings and it's up to them to decide, because because they can still and I'm sure, and I'm sure you don't know, because you don't, you don't really follow up or have like a need to care to follow up, but I'm sure you've probably sent stuff into a club and go.
00:18:39.541 --> 00:18:41.846
There's no way that that person's getting in.
00:18:41.846 --> 00:18:48.423
Sure I'm sure they sure as hell got in that that person's getting in sure.
00:18:48.462 --> 00:18:49.506
I'm sure they sure as hell got in well.
00:18:49.506 --> 00:18:51.511
So here's the thing is if you're using us, then you care about who you're letting in.
00:18:51.511 --> 00:18:55.702
It's very true and so, yes, I will give you the the examples.
00:18:55.702 --> 00:18:59.441
Yes, there are times where we're like there's no way that this person's admitted.
00:18:59.441 --> 00:19:01.364
But it is really up, it is 100 up to club.
00:19:01.364 --> 00:19:05.092
We highlight anything that needs to be looked at.
00:19:05.092 --> 00:19:08.084
So your average report is very mundane.
00:19:08.084 --> 00:19:19.086
It's Bill, he's a chiropractor and he's got a nice family and he lives down the street and everything he said on his application because we get that too everything is set as application is accurate.
00:19:19.086 --> 00:19:22.343
Verifying the information that was provided to us is a big part of it too.
00:19:22.343 --> 00:19:35.406
So if the person says I'm this, that and the other, and I'm on this board and I'm this person and I'm this and I went to this school and I know these people, and it's on that application, we verify that those things are accurate, because people will lie on those things.
00:19:35.406 --> 00:19:37.669
Like any other type of application, people don't always tell the truth.
00:19:37.669 --> 00:19:40.669
So, yes, there are times where we send the reports.
00:19:42.555 --> 00:19:43.476
It's subjective.
00:19:43.476 --> 00:19:46.978
One club might say, yeah, we'll overlook that and it's fine.
00:19:46.978 --> 00:19:48.699
One club might say absolutely not.
00:19:48.699 --> 00:19:55.343
One club might have a conversation with that person and say, hey, listen, you had four alcohol arrests in the last five years.
00:19:55.343 --> 00:19:59.405
This appears to be a problem at something that we just can't have.
00:19:59.405 --> 00:20:00.386
We can't tolerate that here.
00:20:00.386 --> 00:20:03.229
We don't want you getting pulled over and getting another DUI after leaving the club.
00:20:03.229 --> 00:20:11.460
That's a bad look for us.
00:20:11.460 --> 00:20:14.063
Local police departments don't like that when that happens.
00:20:14.063 --> 00:20:15.861
So it might be a conversation.
00:20:15.861 --> 00:20:36.901
Then there's the high-level ones, where not only do we highlight everything, like we always do, you might get a phone call from me or from Janine or someone in our office, and the phone call is going to be to actually help walk you through what you're about to read, because there are some things that are harder to explain in words on a report.
00:20:36.901 --> 00:20:43.261
So we have that customer services there and it's like hey, okay, you're going to get this report.
00:20:43.261 --> 00:20:45.086
I want you to open it with me when you get it.
00:20:45.086 --> 00:20:46.176
Let's go through it together.
00:20:46.897 --> 00:20:56.778
Sometimes it's a matter of let me explain a little bit better than we can on paper how we got to that profile online is your applicant, because it's sometimes very difficult.
00:20:56.778 --> 00:21:05.922
We had to go through seven different avenues to prove that that profile, that some random bizarre name online is your person, but let me walk you through it so you know.
00:21:05.922 --> 00:21:08.261
Bizarre name online is your person, but let me walk you through it, so you know.
00:21:08.261 --> 00:21:14.580
Or this is a really weird one and I need to explain to you what this means because I had to google it and I was.
00:21:14.681 --> 00:21:22.455
It was awful to google and I didn't want to have to google it, but I googled what it is and this is what the person's into and I didn't want to write on paper necessarily.
00:21:22.455 --> 00:21:24.436
So I've had to have those conversations.
00:21:24.436 --> 00:21:26.378
I've had to have those conversations.
00:21:26.378 --> 00:21:44.992
I've had to have those conversations where it's like you know, using your furry in the background I'm not going to assume that every membership director or general manager is up to speed on local furry terms, so I may have to Google some things and explain what the person's into and say you know, if the club has stuffed animals laying around, you might have to hide those.
00:21:45.335 --> 00:21:53.942
And there's nothing wrong with being what people are into no, not at all, and I'm using that as an example, because most of the things we see are a little bit more devious than that.
00:21:53.942 --> 00:21:58.218
Um, but you know, I'm pretty sure you're a pg podcast, so we'll leave it at that.
00:21:58.238 --> 00:21:59.401
No, I mean no, I mean this is.
00:21:59.401 --> 00:22:03.376
I mean this is, this is a niche show and this is, this is a very I mean.
00:22:03.376 --> 00:22:16.180
To me this is like an important topic because, like clubs are a very important and sacred place and, you know, not every club is for every person and that that always kills me too is, you know, the clubs that just let anybody in and like and I guess there's a place for those.
00:22:16.180 --> 00:22:21.458
But it's like a club to me like has a personality, like a, it's like a living, breathing thing.
00:22:21.458 --> 00:22:26.585
You know more or less, and it has, like it's it's a thing and you get those right people in there.
00:22:26.585 --> 00:22:35.335
Because you know, I've performed at clubs where you you can tell like it is a vibe and it's a place and there's others you can be like I'm just a little off here like just like mismatch or something.
00:22:35.335 --> 00:22:45.121
Um, and then, and real quick, if people want a sample of a report, can they go to membervettingcom and request a sample report of what a report would look like.
00:22:45.121 --> 00:22:46.124
That that can get.
00:22:46.724 --> 00:22:47.346
Absolutely so.
