March 23, 2026

487: Can Mini Golf Actually Work at a Club?

Mini golf is not just windmills, clown heads, and beach town nostalgia. In this episode, Denny talks with Katie and Sal Conaboy of Harris Golf about how modern mini golf can become a real amenity for clubs, resorts, and golf properties. They get into how premium custom courses can create more family engagement, give clubs fresh programming ideas, and turn underused space into something fun, beautiful, and genuinely useful. They also talk about why clubs need to get more creative, how mini gol...

Apple Podcasts podcast player badge
Spotify podcast player badge
Amazon Music podcast player badge
Castro podcast player badge
RSS Feed podcast player badge
Apple Podcasts podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconAmazon Music podcast player iconCastro podcast player iconRSS Feed podcast player icon

Mini golf is not just windmills, clown heads, and beach town nostalgia.

In this episode, Denny talks with Katie and Sal Conaboy of Harris Golf about how modern mini golf can become a real amenity for clubs, resorts, and golf properties. They get into how premium custom courses can create more family engagement, give clubs fresh programming ideas, and turn underused space into something fun, beautiful, and genuinely useful.

They also talk about why clubs need to get more creative, how mini golf can work for camps, family nights, tournaments, and events, and why putting style courses are becoming part of the conversation too. Plus, Katie and Sal share what stood out from the PGA Show and what they are seeing as golf properties continue to evolve.

Follow us on the socials

Private Club Radio Instagram
Private Club Radio Linkedin

Denny Corby Instagram
Denny Corby Linkedin

WEBVTT

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:05.610
Welcome to the Private Club Radio Show, the show where you get the scoop on life inside private golf and country clubs.

00:00:05.690 --> 00:00:13.580
I'm your host, Denny Corby, and each episode is a real conversation with club leaders, the pros, the people and partners who help clubs thrive.

00:00:13.970 --> 00:00:20.929
We talk leadership, culture, food and beverage, member experiences, member engagement, marketing, governance, and so much more.

00:00:21.230 --> 00:00:27.350
If you want practical ideas, better teams and a club experience, members actually feel and talk about.

00:00:27.739 --> 00:00:29.390
You are in the right place now.

00:00:29.690 --> 00:00:30.559
Welcome to the show.

00:00:30.780 --> 00:00:35.070
In this episode, I am talking with friends of mine from high school.

00:00:35.581 --> 00:00:38.970
Something I never thought I would be saying here on the show.

00:00:38.970 --> 00:00:41.820
I think I'm just getting old and I ate this.

00:00:43.710 --> 00:00:47.371
See, in this episode we are talking about mini golf.

00:00:47.985 --> 00:00:53.445
Yes, miniature golf, but not in the sense that you are thinking.

00:00:53.445 --> 00:00:55.396
So let me take this back.

00:00:55.396 --> 00:00:55.426
I.

00:00:55.926 --> 00:00:58.415
We are chatting with Sal and Katie Convoy.

00:00:58.415 --> 00:01:06.615
They are the president and CEO of Harris Mini Golf It's a family business and they are from my town.

00:01:06.646 --> 00:01:09.135
I graduated high school with them.

00:01:09.316 --> 00:01:11.415
They are uh, they were high school sweethearts.

00:01:11.415 --> 00:01:13.876
They are now married and have kids and took over.

00:01:14.430 --> 00:01:19.290
The family business and they make really amazing miniature golf courses.

00:01:19.290 --> 00:01:25.980
They design and help and create and build the most amazing mini golf courses all over the world.

00:01:26.480 --> 00:01:38.661
And I'm bringing them on because there are clubs, private golf, and country clubs who are seeing a little bit of how mini golf can be a really cool creative asset and amenity for their club.

00:01:39.161 --> 00:01:45.756
And that's what I love about having this show and this platform is sometimes the things that I want to bring on and talk about.

00:01:46.256 --> 00:01:53.006
Sometimes it might not relate a thousand percent or be a hundred percent on point, but at least gets creative juices flowing.

00:01:53.006 --> 00:01:54.626
It gets ideas going.

00:01:54.835 --> 00:01:58.406
It just helps open up the brain and just get the synapsis moving.

00:01:58.906 --> 00:02:14.256
You just never know where creativity goes and where ideas come from and where something sparks from, even though it's not a hundred percent maybe for what you need, but just the ideas create the creativity and the who, what, where, when, why behind it can spark so much.

00:02:14.756 --> 00:02:26.395
So this is really how clubs are getting more creative with how they use their property and their spaces and how, you know, a lot of people don't even realize what mini golf is in theirs.

00:02:26.665 --> 00:02:39.415
Uh, a lot of pushback because there is some of that old mental imagery of cheesy or corny courses, but it doesn't have to be that way, and that's not where golf and mini golf is going.

00:02:39.915 --> 00:02:50.385
cause mini golf and golf can be premium, it can be attractive, it could be custom, it could be low key, and it could be designed to fit the aesthetics of wherever it needs to be.

00:02:50.596 --> 00:02:59.235
And what's really great about mini golf and things of this nature and clubs and what we do is it's generational fun.

00:02:59.735 --> 00:03:02.346
They're not just designed for kids.

00:03:02.346 --> 00:03:03.816
This is generational fun.

00:03:03.816 --> 00:03:07.031
It's about getting people out, moving and creating memories.

00:03:07.413 --> 00:03:14.098
So I was just super thrilled to chat with my friends to bring them on, And I just love what they're doing.

00:03:14.397 --> 00:03:15.927
I think mini golf is so much fun.

00:03:15.927 --> 00:03:17.068
It is so much fun.

00:03:17.068 --> 00:03:18.687
And I'm surprised some clubs don't.

00:03:19.423 --> 00:03:26.413
Take advantage of and do more of a more custom made, cool little mini golf course at their clubs.

00:03:26.413 --> 00:03:29.443
'cause some clubs have some really cool spaces and things.

00:03:29.443 --> 00:03:35.532
And this really could be, I think, something neat for clubs to use as an amenity and as an upsell.

00:03:35.582 --> 00:03:39.872
Now before some of you listen and go, oh, this would never be for me, this would never be for my club.

00:03:39.872 --> 00:03:42.962
That's not what this episode or this point is about.

00:03:42.962 --> 00:03:44.643
It's about getting creative.

00:03:44.643 --> 00:03:50.492
It's about opening up your eyes to seeing what's available, what's out there, what can be done, what could be done.

00:03:50.793 --> 00:03:57.573
And if at a bare minimum, it'd be neat just for as, as a creative exercise for you just to go, how can.

00:03:57.987 --> 00:03:59.578
Mini golf fit here, right?

00:03:59.578 --> 00:04:07.272
I think sometimes when we think of an idea or we see an idea or we hear an idea or someone mentions an idea, the first thing we do is go, that will never work.

00:04:08.883 --> 00:04:17.853
I think sometimes, and especially in today's day and age, we should think about how it can work, not because it has to, but just as a creative exercise, right?

00:04:17.853 --> 00:04:23.983
Just to say, Hey, if my board came to me and said, Hey, in the next two years we want a mini golf course.

00:04:24.788 --> 00:04:25.898
How would we do that here?

00:04:26.408 --> 00:04:27.937
I think it'd be a cool, creative endeavor.

00:04:27.937 --> 00:04:33.187
Like what would you do to make it the most epic mini golf course a private club has ever had?

00:04:33.187 --> 00:04:39.338
How can you use your aesthetics, your terrain, your design, where you're at, right?

00:04:39.338 --> 00:04:42.608
How can you make it really cool and custom to your club?

00:04:43.298 --> 00:04:50.048
That's what this is about, and they're friends of mine, and I love helping out my friends and talking with my friends.

00:04:50.548 --> 00:04:54.708
Not often I get to bring, I don't think I've ever brought a friend from high school onto my show.

00:04:56.180 --> 00:05:00.949
they also did an episode on the Economics of Everyday Things, which is a Freakonomics podcast.

00:05:00.949 --> 00:05:04.970
It was episode one 15, miniature Golf, the Economics of Everyday Things.

00:05:04.970 --> 00:05:14.720
If you wanna dig down, uh, and learn more about the economics of mini golf, which it's just a really cool, fascinating episode, and it's like only 20 minutes, highly recommend it.

00:05:15.220 --> 00:05:16.855
And before we get to the show.

00:05:17.355 --> 00:05:24.584
If you or your club is looking for one of the most fun member event nights, you can have head on over to denny corby.com.

00:05:24.584 --> 00:05:26.324
There's excitement, there's mystery.

00:05:26.595 --> 00:05:28.605
Also, there's magic, mind dreaming and comedy.

00:05:28.605 --> 00:05:30.824
A ton of laughs, gasps, and holy craps.

00:05:31.004 --> 00:05:34.214
One of the most fun member event nights you can have guaranteed.

00:05:34.725 --> 00:05:37.095
If you wanna learn more, head on over to denny corby.com.

00:05:37.095 --> 00:05:38.444
Fill out the form, reach out.

00:05:39.105 --> 00:05:42.035
Let's talk about your club and your fun events.

00:05:42.535 --> 00:05:43.915
About that though, let's get to the show.

00:05:43.915 --> 00:05:45.685
Private Club Radio listeners, that's welcome.

00:05:46.375 --> 00:05:50.185
Katie and Sal Conna boy from Harris Mini Golf.

00:05:50.685 --> 00:05:58.485
it is just, it is crazy how coming from high school, we both ended up oddly in like the golf space.

00:05:59.295 --> 00:06:00.045
That is funny.

00:06:00.194 --> 00:06:00.824
So weird.

00:06:00.824 --> 00:06:01.785
Like, it is so weird to me.

00:06:01.785 --> 00:06:08.985
I was cracking up to myself, like laughing, for the people who don't know, can you give us a quick overview of Harris Golf and kinda what got you guys to here?

00:06:08.985 --> 00:06:12.134
'cause I know it was your family business, Katie, which is even cooler.

00:06:12.285 --> 00:06:15.375
Uh,'cause you know, family business stuff to me is al always amazing.

00:06:15.375 --> 00:06:18.105
But how did you guys get to where you're at here?

00:06:18.605 --> 00:06:23.435
Yeah, so Harris, miniature golf as the company was founded in 1958.

00:06:23.435 --> 00:06:25.564
So we've been around for almost 70 years.

00:06:26.089 --> 00:06:44.500
My family got involved, my dad purchased the company in 1988, and so all growing up, you know, every vacation we were visiting miniature golf courses and so I've always been involved a little bit in that way, but Sal and I officially became involved with Harris and, you know, took over the company in 2023.

00:06:45.430 --> 00:06:45.939
That's awesome.

00:06:46.149 --> 00:06:48.100
What, what, what, what got that going?

00:06:48.100 --> 00:06:49.420
Like what, what was that change?

00:06:49.920 --> 00:06:55.500
Yeah, my, my dad was ready to retire and Sal and I have always been interested.

00:06:55.500 --> 00:07:11.160
We've had many conversations over the years with my dad about being involved in Harris and in the company, and we both had different careers at the time, but I think his kind of moving towards retirement got his brain thinking and he.

00:07:11.625 --> 00:07:13.935
Agreed that it would be a good move for Al and I.

00:07:13.935 --> 00:07:16.545
Something we were really passionate about being business owners.

00:07:17.045 --> 00:07:17.285
Right.

00:07:17.285 --> 00:07:17.824
And it worked out.

00:07:18.300 --> 00:07:18.589
Yeah.

00:07:18.595 --> 00:07:18.665
Yeah.

00:07:19.055 --> 00:07:19.535
That's awesome.

00:07:19.834 --> 00:07:23.495
The company was doing so well and the industry is doing so well.

00:07:23.855 --> 00:07:26.285
Um, and it, it was just such a great fit for us.

00:07:26.285 --> 00:07:27.185
It made a lot of sense.

00:07:27.185 --> 00:07:29.855
So we made the jump from our careers to this end.

00:07:29.855 --> 00:07:31.084
It's been great ever since.

00:07:31.685 --> 00:07:31.954
Yeah.

00:07:32.345 --> 00:07:38.345
Was there, has there, has there been anything that has surprised you about where this business has taken you?

00:07:38.845 --> 00:07:42.954
Um, it every day there's surprises every day, you know?

00:07:43.074 --> 00:07:43.134
Yeah.

00:07:43.139 --> 00:07:46.134
It's, it's, it's such an interesting industry, you know?

00:07:46.194 --> 00:07:52.514
Um, we build for, we build for all different types of people, all different types of places.

00:07:52.845 --> 00:08:02.084
Um, we build at high end resorts to, um, mom and pop campgrounds, to, um, really nice golf courses, traditional golf courses.

00:08:02.084 --> 00:08:02.629
So, yeah.

00:08:03.509 --> 00:08:04.889
It's amazing what we get to do.

00:08:04.889 --> 00:08:11.519
I mean, this morning we were talking about putting a giant rhino head on top of a waterfall, um, for, for a customer.

00:08:11.519 --> 00:08:18.360
And then we're talking about, you know, um, really nice putting courses, um, for high end golf resorts.

00:08:18.360 --> 00:08:21.120
So it's, it runs the gamut.

00:08:21.540 --> 00:08:21.779
Yeah,

00:08:21.889 --> 00:08:28.045
For someone just hearing about you and your world for the first time, how do you describe what you do without?

00:08:28.790 --> 00:08:32.570
Them instantly picturing like a windmill and a little sad clown.

00:08:32.600 --> 00:08:36.409
Because I think like sometimes when people think of like mini golf and things, like, that's like what, what comes to mind?

00:08:36.409 --> 00:08:40.940
So how do you describe what you guys do to people, uh, when you, when you first meet'em?

00:08:41.440 --> 00:08:44.529
Yeah, so we, um, obviously we get that a lot.

00:08:44.590 --> 00:08:53.080
Um, and then we also get the reaction, oh, I didn't know that there's actually people that did that, you know, so, um, we.

00:08:54.009 --> 00:08:56.919
We build premium style mentor golf courses.

00:08:57.309 --> 00:09:09.429
We, we, uh, our courses are, um, not the traditional putt putt or, uh, windmill courses or, you know, straight shots, um, one par holes.

00:09:09.490 --> 00:09:20.024
You know, we, we like to build premium concrete courses that are waterfall, garden style, um, mini golf courses that people are gonna wanna come back and play again and again.

00:09:20.860 --> 00:09:27.639
So, um, yeah, so we do get that question a lot and it is interesting and, um, it's fun to think about that.

00:09:27.639 --> 00:09:40.149
And every once in a while we get a customer that wants a traditional miniature golf course and, uh, yeah, we kinda, you know, if they're doing this as a business, we kind of gear them towards what we do and it, it makes a lot more sense.

00:09:40.960 --> 00:09:45.820
So what we really specialize in is creating the best playing miniature golf holes.

00:09:46.134 --> 00:09:48.835
That appeals to the widest market.

00:09:49.375 --> 00:09:58.735
So what we really focus on is making sure that a young child is going to have just as much fun as their grandparents and everybody in between, golfers, non-golfers.

00:09:58.884 --> 00:10:04.225
We want everyone to have the same amazing experience when they play every single hole on our courses.

00:10:04.725 --> 00:10:05.774
Generational fun.

00:10:06.375 --> 00:10:06.975
Exactly.

00:10:07.125 --> 00:10:07.544
That's right.

00:10:08.235 --> 00:10:13.184
And, and, and, and I, the way my, my brain goes, I want to take the, take, take it back a little bit.

00:10:13.424 --> 00:10:16.845
What did you mean by concrete courses?

00:10:16.845 --> 00:10:19.514
Is there like a different type of course.

00:10:19.514 --> 00:10:21.345
Is that, is like, is that like a good quality?

00:10:21.345 --> 00:10:25.845
Can you, can you describe what a concrete course is and maybe what like a different non concrete courses?

00:10:26.414 --> 00:10:26.774
Sure.

00:10:26.774 --> 00:10:31.544
So there's, there's, uh, a wide variety of different courses you could get.

00:10:31.544 --> 00:10:34.095
So you could get wooden fiberglass, um.

00:10:34.595 --> 00:10:36.335
You know, foam courses.

00:10:36.485 --> 00:10:42.634
Um, but what we build is concrete onsite courses, you know, so we're, we're pouring everything on site.

00:10:42.634 --> 00:10:43.955
We're forming it up on site.

00:10:44.254 --> 00:10:51.725
Um, those other types of courses are typically modulars, so they'll, they're built in a factory and then they're shipped to the customer.

00:10:52.294 --> 00:10:55.625
Uh, but we do everything on site and it's all custom.

00:10:55.955 --> 00:10:59.554
Um, anything that we do is all done by hand on site.

00:11:00.544 --> 00:11:13.894
And because we build with concrete opposed to wood or another material, we have a lot more flexibility with the creativity of our holes, the shapes that we can use, the mounding and things like that to really, you know, create exciting golf holes.

00:11:14.705 --> 00:11:14.764
Yeah.

00:11:14.764 --> 00:11:22.985
And I'm sure there's probably a little bit more costly, a little bit more, takes more time and things, but I'm sure the end result is clearly night and day.

00:11:23.485 --> 00:11:24.355
Exactly, yeah.

00:11:24.414 --> 00:11:28.465
And, and the maintenance and the longevity of the course is night and day.

00:11:28.965 --> 00:11:29.205
Yep.

00:11:30.524 --> 00:11:30.735
Yep.

00:11:30.740 --> 00:11:38.085
And, and I'm sure all, uh, depending on where the course is at too, that's like concrete's probably the most stable thing to use.

00:11:38.585 --> 00:11:39.365
Yeah, exactly.

00:11:39.370 --> 00:11:39.409
Yeah.

00:11:39.409 --> 00:11:41.254
So it's, it's, yeah.

00:11:41.254 --> 00:11:42.965
It's gonna hold up for decades.

00:11:43.445 --> 00:11:43.715
Yeah.

00:11:44.090 --> 00:11:44.360
Yeah.

00:11:44.659 --> 00:11:47.779
And, and you guys were just down the PGA show too.

00:11:47.779 --> 00:11:47.990
I know.

00:11:47.990 --> 00:11:49.549
I was trying to send, send some friends over.

00:11:49.730 --> 00:11:53.059
Uh, I know you, you had some people down there repping Harris Golf.

00:11:53.149 --> 00:11:54.860
Uh, what, what was that show like for you?

00:11:54.860 --> 00:11:58.370
Because I know you guys have done it a little bit in the past and now you're coming back into it.

00:11:58.370 --> 00:12:03.259
What was it like, you know, you know, so the PGA show was over, what was, what, what stood out?

00:12:03.259 --> 00:12:04.009
What was exciting?

00:12:04.509 --> 00:12:04.750
Yeah.

00:12:04.750 --> 00:12:06.580
It, it's great to be back at the show.

00:12:06.580 --> 00:12:07.990
This is our third year back.

00:12:07.990 --> 00:12:08.080
Mm-hmm.

00:12:08.455 --> 00:12:09.615
Um, and.

00:12:10.014 --> 00:12:15.294
The, the overall response that we're getting from customers is, I'm so glad you're here.

00:12:15.745 --> 00:12:16.884
You know, I'm so glad you're here.

00:12:16.884 --> 00:12:18.325
I really wanted to talk to you.

00:12:18.745 --> 00:12:20.845
Um, so it's, it's really nice to be back.

00:12:20.845 --> 00:12:22.375
We're getting some really good leads.

00:12:22.705 --> 00:12:35.965
Um, I think golf in general is just, it's just on an upswing, no pun intended, the last few years, you know, so, um, and, and we're going along for the ride, you know, and yeah.

00:12:36.144 --> 00:12:38.485
Um, and we do that, you know.

00:12:39.340 --> 00:12:44.259
When driving ranges start to do really well, they start calling us to put in another amenity.

00:12:44.350 --> 00:12:46.659
When golf courses start to do well, they start to call us.

00:12:47.080 --> 00:12:48.309
Um, mm.

00:12:48.309 --> 00:12:59.259
You know, it kind of, but I think PGA in general is doing such a good job of getting people excited about the game of golf and, um, at all levels, you know?

00:12:59.559 --> 00:12:59.769
Yeah.

00:12:59.830 --> 00:13:05.379
Um, so I think that's, that's helping us within the golf industry.

00:13:06.159 --> 00:13:06.429
Yeah.

00:13:06.850 --> 00:13:13.179
Do you, do you feel like golf and clubs and properties are getting more creative in, in that sort of space?

00:13:13.179 --> 00:13:14.769
And that's where you kind of come in also?

00:13:15.970 --> 00:13:18.250
Yeah, and I, I, I think they have to, right?

00:13:18.250 --> 00:13:27.820
I think, um, not only to, um, create more revenue, but to, um, bring in more members.

00:13:27.909 --> 00:13:33.325
To retain members, um, I think it's important for clubs to get creative in what they're offering.

00:13:34.315 --> 00:13:37.164
Um, so I think that's where we come into play.

00:13:37.375 --> 00:13:42.894
You know, we create something that's, um, available for the whole family, not just the golfer, the family.

00:13:43.309 --> 00:13:43.600
Yeah.

00:13:44.184 --> 00:13:44.485
Yeah.

00:13:44.664 --> 00:13:47.200
And now, because so many clubs and places are becoming that.

00:13:47.845 --> 00:13:49.254
Like resort style.

00:13:49.284 --> 00:13:51.894
People want that one stop shop.

00:13:51.894 --> 00:13:54.144
They can bring their, that generational fun.

00:13:54.144 --> 00:13:59.904
They can bring, Hey, bring the kids over, bring the friends, bring the outta town family and just make it a fun place.

00:13:59.904 --> 00:14:05.004
So having something like that is, is definitely a, a great amenity to have.

00:14:05.335 --> 00:14:07.044
Um, have you seen any, um.

00:14:07.544 --> 00:14:11.034
Smart ways, some of the properties and places that you're working with.

00:14:11.034 --> 00:14:17.514
Have you seen any cool or maybe unique ways that they're using the spaces that maybe clubs can learn from that they aren't already doing?

00:14:18.014 --> 00:14:19.245
Yeah, that's a great question.

00:14:19.245 --> 00:14:29.174
I mean, it's there, there's a lot of ways they could tie it into kids camps, you know, they could tie it into, um, events, you know, offered at their, um.

00:14:29.595 --> 00:14:31.725
Any event that they're having as addition

00:14:33.105 --> 00:14:34.095
like that?

00:14:34.100 --> 00:14:34.240
Yeah.

00:14:34.340 --> 00:14:34.559
Um,

00:14:34.695 --> 00:14:35.024
yeah.

00:14:35.414 --> 00:14:39.105
You know, they could, um, they could use it for family nights.

00:14:39.195 --> 00:14:49.485
Um, there it is, just, it's just such a white, they could have tournaments, you know, mini golf tournaments and it could be, you know, dad usually goes off to play at tournaments in the club.

00:14:49.485 --> 00:14:54.720
But this could be a chance for dad to bring, um, you know, his 6-year-old or 7-year-old, 8-year-old.

00:14:55.394 --> 00:15:00.495
With them to play a, uh, mini golf tournament or a, a putting tournament at the club.

00:15:00.524 --> 00:15:00.884
Yeah.

00:15:01.125 --> 00:15:07.754
You know, so they're just, there's, the opportunities are, are really endless, I think to integrate it within, within the club.

00:15:08.504 --> 00:15:08.774
Yeah.

00:15:08.985 --> 00:15:11.715
This is a side quest question,'cause I'm on some brand new meds.

00:15:11.955 --> 00:15:19.004
Do, do you, when you're designing the courses and you're working with people and designing the courses, do you.

00:15:19.695 --> 00:15:23.865
Uh, I would, I, I would maybe assume, do you like your architects, your designers?

00:15:23.924 --> 00:15:28.065
Are they also kind of like, is there, uh, how do I phrase it?

00:15:28.065 --> 00:15:38.054
Like, is the engineering there to where you go, Hey, if the ball is hit here, like, do you map out like how the ball is supposed to go and all

00:15:38.054 --> 00:15:38.205
that?

00:15:38.205 --> 00:15:42.284
Yeah, I would say it's, it's more, it's more physics than, uh, engineer.

00:15:42.345 --> 00:15:43.424
You know what I mean?

00:15:43.424 --> 00:15:43.904
I mean.

00:15:44.414 --> 00:15:45.014
We consider, uh,

00:15:45.014 --> 00:15:49.335
yeah, actually no, I don't because I wasn't smart enough for physics in high school.

00:15:49.424 --> 00:15:49.575
Me either.

00:15:49.575 --> 00:15:51.615
So, full transparency.

00:15:51.615 --> 00:15:51.945
No,

00:15:53.115 --> 00:15:56.414
but you know, we're, yeah, we're absolutely considering that type of stuff.

00:15:56.414 --> 00:15:58.695
You know, how is the ball gonna roll on this surface?

00:15:58.695 --> 00:16:03.495
Or, you know, if we put this type of material down or, or this sort of bank shot.

00:16:03.794 --> 00:16:13.309
Um, but we're always thinking about contours, undulations, um, breaks in the green, you know, so it's, we think like.

00:16:14.009 --> 00:16:19.470
Traditional golf course builders, you know, how they're thinking when they're building their courses.

00:16:19.919 --> 00:16:20.009
Mm-hmm.

00:16:20.250 --> 00:16:24.389
Um, you know, even our fairways and our, um, penalty areas.

00:16:24.389 --> 00:16:28.200
You know, we think it's miniature golf, but we're thinking about all those things.

00:16:28.860 --> 00:16:29.129
Yeah.

00:16:29.220 --> 00:16:32.279
And also making sure there's multiple ways to play each hole.

00:16:32.309 --> 00:16:32.490
Yep.

00:16:32.490 --> 00:16:32.580
Right.

00:16:32.940 --> 00:16:39.659
For, and that plays into the generational fund, but also when people come back, they can try the challenge another way.

00:16:39.659 --> 00:16:43.409
If you're gonna play it off the bank this time, or try to shoot around the planter.

00:16:43.799 --> 00:16:46.320
You know, and just all the different challenges in that way.

00:16:46.865 --> 00:16:47.154
Yeah,

00:16:47.154 --> 00:16:47.549
yeah, yeah.

00:16:47.730 --> 00:17:04.529
The really fun thing about the, the courses that we build, um, the miniature golf courses that we build is Dad could line up and, and line up his putt perfectly and, and putt his strategic putt and, you know, end up four feet from the hole.

00:17:04.529 --> 00:17:06.839
And, uh, son or daughter could line up.

00:17:08.009 --> 00:17:11.250
Whack it and accidentally hit a hole in one, you know?

00:17:11.250 --> 00:17:15.990
So then they go home and they tell everyone they beat that and, you know, and it's so exciting.

00:17:15.990 --> 00:17:18.869
And that's, that's the fun, you know, that's what it's all about.

00:17:18.875 --> 00:17:19.105
Yeah.

00:17:19.605 --> 00:17:19.845
Yeah.

00:17:20.444 --> 00:17:22.424
Are there, and for how many.

00:17:23.849 --> 00:17:30.750
Courses you guys build, what are some mistakes maybe you see people make as they're planning a project like this?

00:17:30.750 --> 00:17:36.210
Like do sometimes people think too small, too big, too cheesy, too hidden, too random?

00:17:36.210 --> 00:17:36.690
Like what?

00:17:36.839 --> 00:17:40.799
Like what do you see when people are coming into do this?

00:17:41.299 --> 00:17:45.045
I think it's just understanding your demographic and your area.

00:17:45.315 --> 00:17:48.855
So when we're building at a resort area.

00:17:49.559 --> 00:18:03.420
At the beach, that is when having bigger features, maybe theming is super important versus, you know, when we build out a campground, going more basic is what people expect.

00:18:03.630 --> 00:18:09.599
So I think playing into and really understanding who's coming to your course, how you need to draw people in.

00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:09.690
Mm-hmm.

00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:14.460
When we're considering all the design features is really what's most important.

00:18:14.730 --> 00:18:16.769
And then of course, having the right people on board.

00:18:17.130 --> 00:18:17.400
Um.

00:18:18.224 --> 00:18:27.105
You know, of course we think us the experts in designing, but also having your other contractors that are gonna be involved in the course, um, to really be experts in their fields as well.

00:18:27.914 --> 00:18:28.575
Do you make sense?

00:18:28.575 --> 00:18:28.724
Yeah.

00:18:29.224 --> 00:18:33.605
How long does a, like, like what's a, what's a typical time like a timeline look like from.

00:18:34.414 --> 00:18:39.545
And I don't wanna say initial contact, but like once, like the ball's rolling, no pun intended.

00:18:39.845 --> 00:18:40.174
What?

00:18:40.174 --> 00:18:43.420
Uh, this would be, the whole show is just like all just I love that one.

00:18:43.424 --> 00:18:44.375
The worst golf puns.

00:18:45.545 --> 00:18:47.464
That's my favorite one to send to customers.

00:18:47.674 --> 00:18:49.204
What could we do to get the ball rolling?

00:18:52.744 --> 00:18:54.500
We didn't, we, we didn't come up short, did we?

00:18:54.605 --> 00:18:54.845
No.

00:18:55.505 --> 00:18:58.414
Oh, you should, you should have a horrible email.

00:18:58.565 --> 00:19:01.025
And the less they respond, the worse they get.

00:19:04.130 --> 00:19:10.789
Um, uh, so what does, like the normal like timeline scope look, and I'm sure it's all relative depending on the who, what, where, when, whys.

00:19:10.789 --> 00:19:14.839
But is there like an average timeframe of like how long a course takes to complete?

00:19:15.339 --> 00:19:19.869
Yeah, it probably takes from initial context, so starting the design, right?

00:19:19.869 --> 00:19:26.859
So reaching out to us and telling us you wanna start our design and getting us a, a survey of your site, it probably takes about a year.

00:19:27.250 --> 00:19:30.130
Not, that's not the construction, that's not the design.

00:19:30.130 --> 00:19:36.460
The design will, will take us anywhere from three to four weeks to design, um, depending on our availability.

00:19:36.910 --> 00:19:37.450
Um, yeah.

00:19:37.779 --> 00:19:49.930
But then once you go from there, once you decide, okay, we're gonna build it, then you have to start getting on your other contractors or, or, um, getting approvals, getting financing, doing all these things.

00:19:49.990 --> 00:19:53.015
Um, permits that goes into typical construction.

00:19:53.605 --> 00:19:55.464
You know, at the end of the day, this is construction.

00:19:55.464 --> 00:19:59.244
It's fun, it's miniature golf, it's exciting, but it is construction, so permitting.

00:19:59.605 --> 00:20:02.545
Um, so that takes, that takes the bulk of the time.

00:20:02.845 --> 00:20:09.295
And then from the time when we get on site, it takes about four to six weeks, um, for us to build the course.

00:20:10.134 --> 00:20:10.464
Um, not bad.

00:20:10.825 --> 00:20:11.545
And then that's it.

00:20:11.545 --> 00:20:12.444
And then you're ready to go.

00:20:12.944 --> 00:20:13.724
That's not bad at all.

00:20:13.994 --> 00:20:14.865
No, no.

00:20:16.035 --> 00:20:16.545
That's not bad.

00:20:16.950 --> 00:20:25.529
No, we have a pretty good, a pretty good system down of, uh, pre-construction, construction management, um, and then obviously construction.

00:20:25.799 --> 00:20:34.289
We've kind of fine tuned everything over the 65 plus years of doing this, uh, to be as efficient as possible.

00:20:34.890 --> 00:20:35.519
So we get there.

00:20:35.880 --> 00:20:36.509
The ground running,

00:20:37.009 --> 00:20:38.450
how long does a course last?

00:20:38.900 --> 00:20:41.180
I mean, I would assume years.

00:20:41.329 --> 00:20:41.990
Years.

00:20:42.589 --> 00:20:42.859
Years.

00:20:43.384 --> 00:20:51.125
I mean, yeah, I just answered my, my own question a little bit, but like, so do you, do you have people who come back and go, Hey, like, do you do refreshes?

00:20:51.125 --> 00:20:52.355
Like, do you do stuff like that?

00:20:52.355 --> 00:20:55.805
People are like, Hey, you know, we've, we've had this course, you know, 10 years.

00:20:55.805 --> 00:21:05.555
Can we, you know, maybe move some holes or like, I don't know if that's like a, probably a big thing to do, but like, how do, like, are, do people, can they like refresh their space?

00:21:06.055 --> 00:21:06.835
They certainly can.

00:21:06.839 --> 00:21:07.029
So.

00:21:07.750 --> 00:21:13.779
In terms of how long they last, the concrete portion of it, the bulk of it is going to last, like south said, decades.

00:21:13.990 --> 00:21:19.599
So we have one close by here that was built, I think we're 25 years at this point.

00:21:20.099 --> 00:21:22.470
Over the years they've needed to replace carpet.

00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:30.210
And then recently they did ask to add some of the new rock work that our crews are, you know, have been adding to newer horses.

00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:31.650
So there's things like that.

00:21:31.650 --> 00:21:35.519
Carpet is really the biggest maintenance that is done.

00:21:36.029 --> 00:21:42.869
Every five to seven years to be replaced, but the bulk of the water features and the concrete that really lasts

00:21:43.369 --> 00:21:43.859
forever.

00:21:43.865 --> 00:21:43.984
Yeah.

00:21:44.045 --> 00:21:44.404
Forever.

00:21:44.404 --> 00:21:50.224
As long as you maintain it, you know, and it's, it's properly built and it's built on a solid base.

00:21:50.255 --> 00:21:56.825
You know, that's, that's, a lot of that goes into it is the, the sub base that you're building on and the compaction and the drainage.

00:21:56.914 --> 00:22:02.105
Um, but as long as you build it properly, it should really last forever.

00:22:02.194 --> 00:22:02.555
You know?

00:22:02.555 --> 00:22:04.234
And, and like Katie said, the maintenance of.

00:22:04.714 --> 00:22:07.174
Replacing the carpet really depends on the traffic.

00:22:07.714 --> 00:22:15.275
Um, but it is designed and, um, to last about seven, five to seven years and, and then be replaced.

00:22:16.174 --> 00:22:16.414
And that

00:22:16.714 --> 00:22:17.105
makes a difference.

00:22:18.184 --> 00:22:18.484
Yeah.

00:22:19.085 --> 00:22:19.414
Yeah.

00:22:19.805 --> 00:22:29.825
How important when you're, when, when these spaces are being built and designed, how important is where the space is at, like in terms of visibility?

00:22:30.214 --> 00:22:36.484
Um, like obviously you probably want people to be able to hear it and see it and like feel it.

00:22:36.634 --> 00:22:40.565
So obviously having it more predominantly out, out in the open.

00:22:41.855 --> 00:22:42.365
Absolutely.

00:22:42.365 --> 00:22:45.154
The more visibility, the more traffic you're going to have.

00:22:45.154 --> 00:22:54.875
So if somebody is driving by on a busy road and they see a packed golf course with lots of families having fun, they're immediately going to want to go there.

00:22:54.964 --> 00:22:58.144
And it's also at the top of their mind if it's somewhere they're passing daily.

00:22:58.204 --> 00:22:59.825
So Absolutely.

00:22:59.825 --> 00:23:00.875
The more visibility

00:23:01.384 --> 00:23:01.835
and the nice,

00:23:01.839 --> 00:23:01.970
the better.

00:23:02.000 --> 00:23:02.289
Nice.

00:23:02.404 --> 00:23:02.765
Yeah.

00:23:02.765 --> 00:23:07.144
And the nice thing about our courses is they're, they're beautiful, they're beautifully landscaped.

00:23:07.565 --> 00:23:19.565
Um, they're natural, naturally colored, you know, so it's, it's going to fit in really nicely to, for example, a golf club, you know, you know, it's just, it looks really nice, so.

00:23:19.609 --> 00:23:19.970
Mm-hmm.

00:23:20.734 --> 00:23:21.305
Eye appeal.

00:23:21.305 --> 00:23:22.835
Yeah, it's really nice.

00:23:22.835 --> 00:23:24.545
Curb, curb appeal and eye appeal.

00:23:25.555 --> 00:23:32.575
so when it comes to the, the, the turf and like the maintenance, what is the maintenance look like?

00:23:32.575 --> 00:23:38.664
So like, you know, from like a yearly perspective, like are they fairly low maintenance, high maintenance, and I, and I'm sure it all depends on.

00:23:39.039 --> 00:23:44.619
What you have if, how many moving parts and you know, the how many wheels and you know, whatever if, if, if you have them.

00:23:44.890 --> 00:23:49.329
But, um, like what's like the maintenance, like besides just the, just the turf.

00:23:50.440 --> 00:23:52.839
The daily maintenance really is minimal.

00:23:53.410 --> 00:23:58.240
The turf, we usually recommend that whether you vacuum or blow off with a leaf blower daily.

00:23:58.329 --> 00:24:00.910
So this way there's no leaves or anything on the putting green.

00:24:01.779 --> 00:24:03.549
And I mean, that's really it.

00:24:03.549 --> 00:24:10.750
Otherwise, landscaping, maintenance, and then yearly or sometimes twice a year, if you have water systems, those may need to be cleaned out.

00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:12.039
Um, yep.

00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:21.220
You know, we recommend bleaching or dyeing the systems to kind of keep any of that algae at bay, but they, fortunately as a daily, you know, the daily maintenance is really minimal.

00:24:22.180 --> 00:24:22.599
Wait, sorry.

00:24:22.599 --> 00:24:25.059
People vacuum their, their, their turf.

00:24:26.289 --> 00:24:27.160
You can, yes.

00:24:27.190 --> 00:24:27.400
Yeah.

00:24:27.880 --> 00:24:28.119
Yep.

00:24:28.750 --> 00:24:28.819
Yeah, definitely.

00:24:30.660 --> 00:24:34.890
now with that, what's the, what's the staffing like then?

00:24:34.990 --> 00:24:35.349
No.

00:24:35.349 --> 00:24:37.869
For a mini golf course, it's very minimal.

00:24:37.960 --> 00:24:47.259
You know, you're gonna need, if it's a standalone course, you know, and you're, and you're handing out putters, you're gonna need one or two staff, you know, one to deal with the customer.

00:24:47.470 --> 00:24:47.859
Oh yeah, you're right.

00:24:47.859 --> 00:24:49.240
One, to keep an eye on the course.

00:24:49.809 --> 00:24:49.869
Yeah.

00:24:49.990 --> 00:24:51.069
During busy times.

00:24:51.430 --> 00:24:55.269
Um, if it's something that's located next to your.

00:24:55.690 --> 00:25:08.769
Um, your clubhouse, whether it's a traditional golf course, a FEC, a campground, um, next to your regular clubhouse, then you can operate right outta there, you know?

00:25:08.769 --> 00:25:08.859
Yeah.

00:25:08.890 --> 00:25:17.170
So it may, depending on your situation, may not require any additional staff, if you already have maintenance crews, if you already have ground crews.

00:25:17.410 --> 00:25:21.460
Um, so it, it could be operated very efficiently.

00:25:22.480 --> 00:25:22.569
Yeah.

00:25:25.059 --> 00:25:27.940
What do you think clubs underestimate about this whole category?

00:25:28.440 --> 00:25:29.759
That's a really good question.

00:25:30.089 --> 00:25:35.940
Um, I, I think that there's, there's a little bit of a stigma, right?

00:25:36.210 --> 00:25:38.339
Thinking about traditional miniature golf.

00:25:38.490 --> 00:25:49.410
So when you're, um, when you're thinking about adding it to your club or to your, um, your golf facility, thinking about adding, that just seems a little bit cheesy.

00:25:49.964 --> 00:26:06.845
Um, but when you look at what we do, the premium quality putting style of courses that we build, um, I think that's the biggest, biggest factor that, that some clubs, uh, traditionally have trouble getting over.

00:26:07.384 --> 00:26:15.065
But, um, in terms of like the, the value that it brings, um, it's tremendous.

00:26:15.065 --> 00:26:16.730
Yeah, I, I think that, uh.

00:26:17.525 --> 00:26:24.424
If you think outside the box a little bit and think about the value that this could bring to your club and the different things that you could do.

00:26:24.664 --> 00:26:31.174
I mean, you could have cocktail hours on, on the, on the greens, you know, um, you could

00:26:31.355 --> 00:26:32.224
sip and putts,

00:26:32.765 --> 00:26:33.664
sip and puts.

00:26:33.664 --> 00:26:34.384
I love that.

00:26:34.714 --> 00:26:38.434
Um, you know, birthday parties for the kids in the, in the, uh,

00:26:38.795 --> 00:26:39.275
yeah,

00:26:39.279 --> 00:26:41.194
the kids, the member's kids.

00:26:41.434 --> 00:26:41.795
Um,

00:26:41.825 --> 00:26:42.065
yeah,

00:26:42.335 --> 00:26:46.265
it, it just, and like building, putting fundamentals.

00:26:46.970 --> 00:26:52.670
You know, and for the next generation of golfers, you know, so I, I could go on and on about, um,

00:26:52.789 --> 00:26:53.150
yeah,

00:26:53.390 --> 00:26:57.890
what the, the possibilities you could, you could do within your golf club.

00:26:58.849 --> 00:27:09.500
Well, and I think sometimes when it's like, you know, you think of this and mini golf, they just automatically assume like the big, the, the Gargan shoe and just over the top things where it doesn't have to be that I, I'm assuming, right.

00:27:09.500 --> 00:27:10.400
You can make things.

00:27:10.835 --> 00:27:12.035
Classy tasteful.

00:27:12.035 --> 00:27:25.775
You can, you know, if they have a cool area, you know, some clubs are, you know, tucked away in the woods and they have the, you could probably do some cool stuff, you know, going not between trees, but like you can do really neat stuff that's customized to the club and the space and all that, that doesn't need.

00:27:26.164 --> 00:27:28.835
Pinwheels and waterfalls and rhinos, you know?

00:27:28.835 --> 00:27:28.954
Right.

00:27:28.984 --> 00:27:43.174
Some, for some people and some things that, it's amazing, but for a club, you know, some clubs, they might just say, Hey, how can we make this a really cool, almost like hidden, maybe like low key thing that's like a, not like a hidden, you know, mini course, but it's like, oh, hey, there's like a, you know, off to the side we have this like neat like thing.

00:27:43.505 --> 00:27:44.164
Um,

00:27:45.035 --> 00:27:45.305
yeah.

00:27:45.305 --> 00:27:45.394
Yes.

00:27:45.394 --> 00:27:45.964
Exactly.

00:27:45.964 --> 00:27:54.275
That's really our favorite part is finding the uniqueness, finding what the customer or the company is looking for to make.

00:27:54.694 --> 00:27:58.174
To make miniature golf fit into what they already have existing.

00:27:58.474 --> 00:28:05.164
Um, so exactly like you said, making it fit into the background to where it adds to the aesthetic and the offerings and amenities.

00:28:05.494 --> 00:28:06.904
Um, yeah.

00:28:07.924 --> 00:28:08.255
Yeah.

00:28:08.255 --> 00:28:19.865
And such a great, it's a great anchor business, miniature golf, adding your miniature golf to your, to your already existing facility, and it's also a really good feeder business.

00:28:20.539 --> 00:28:27.890
You know, so whether you're a food and beverage or um, an FEC or a campground, it's a great feeder business.

00:28:27.890 --> 00:28:37.099
So you're gonna bring in additional, uh, additional people that are miniature golf people, you know, they wanna play miniature golf, and then all of a sudden they'll say, what else?

00:28:37.130 --> 00:28:38.240
What else do you have to offer?

00:28:38.809 --> 00:28:39.200
You know?

00:28:39.200 --> 00:28:45.740
So, and to your point about, you know, fitting it anywhere, that's su that's a such a really good point.

00:28:46.039 --> 00:28:48.740
You know, uh, a lot of, um, clubs.

00:28:49.309 --> 00:28:53.089
Have additional space that they just, what are they gonna do with it?

00:28:53.450 --> 00:28:59.509
You know, um, how could it bring value to their, to what they're offering, you know?

00:28:59.509 --> 00:29:06.109
So we, we could work with any landscape, we could work with any topography, with any size.

00:29:06.115 --> 00:29:13.279
I, I say any size, um, most sizes, you know, we could build 9, 18, 36 hole courses.

00:29:13.279 --> 00:29:17.595
So, um, I think that's a really good point and a really, really good way to look at it.

00:29:18.815 --> 00:29:19.115
Yeah.

00:29:19.805 --> 00:29:28.085
What do you, what do you say to the club that might be on the fence or they hear mini golf and think, not at my place, not at my club.

00:29:28.265 --> 00:29:30.365
You know, what, what would you say to them?

00:29:30.865 --> 00:29:32.664
I'd say let us do design.

00:29:33.174 --> 00:29:37.194
Let us do design for you and let us show you what we could bring to your facility.

00:29:37.634 --> 00:29:44.474
We offer, Complementary designs as long as we have, uh, Topo topographic survey of, of the area.

00:29:44.865 --> 00:29:48.134
Um, let us, let us show you what we could bring to the table.

00:29:50.924 --> 00:29:52.154
That's a, that's a killer offer.

00:29:52.454 --> 00:29:53.535
That's a great offer actually.

00:29:53.984 --> 00:29:54.285
Wow.

00:29:54.765 --> 00:29:55.275
Uh.

00:29:55.680 --> 00:30:02.430
I, I was, I was, I, I was gonna say like, you know what, what kind of helps people move from like, oh, like that's a cute idea to like, wait, this can actually be like, really good.

00:30:02.430 --> 00:30:04.710
And I think that just, that just answered it perfectly.

00:30:04.980 --> 00:30:10.920
Uh, if people want to, if a club wants to learn more and reach out, how can they, how can they find you guys?

00:30:12.359 --> 00:30:14.819
Our website is harris mini golf.com.

00:30:15.210 --> 00:30:23.220
We have a ton of information on our website about the process, about the different types of courses that we offer, and then always giving us a call.

00:30:23.849 --> 00:30:26.819
We always answer the phone within three rings.

00:30:26.880 --> 00:30:28.289
Someone's always available.

00:30:28.559 --> 00:30:31.980
Um, and our, our team here is a wealth of information.

00:30:33.059 --> 00:30:33.450
I love it.

00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:34.289
Love it.

00:30:34.289 --> 00:30:36.059
Thank you guys so much for coming on.

00:30:36.059 --> 00:30:37.799
Thanks for being a family business.

00:30:37.799 --> 00:30:38.789
Thanks for being friends.

00:30:38.789 --> 00:30:40.859
Thanks for, you know, being in the same community.

00:30:40.859 --> 00:30:43.140
I, I love this and, uh, love what you guys are doing.

00:30:43.140 --> 00:30:44.220
Keep on, uh, crushing it.

00:30:44.400 --> 00:30:45.000
Thanks for being here.

00:30:45.539 --> 00:30:45.660
Yeah.

00:30:45.660 --> 00:30:46.410
Thank you so much, Denny.

00:30:46.410 --> 00:30:46.950
This was great.

00:30:47.039 --> 00:30:47.250
Yeah.

00:30:47.250 --> 00:30:48.210
Thank you for doing this.

00:30:48.210 --> 00:30:48.900
We appreciate it.

00:30:50.279 --> 00:30:51.869
Hope you all enjoyed that.

00:30:52.859 --> 00:31:01.019
If you want to learn a little bit more about my friends Katie and Sal, head on over to Harris, H-A-R-R-I-S mini golf.com.

00:31:01.230 --> 00:31:02.640
If you're interested, you can even reach out.

00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:04.710
They are amazing, amazing people.

00:31:04.710 --> 00:31:11.807
They have a really cool team, a really cool process, and as you heard, if you have the space, they will do a complimentary mockup design.

00:31:12.249 --> 00:31:12.909
This episode.

00:31:13.269 --> 00:31:16.509
Until next time, I'm your host, Denny Corby Catchall on the flippity flip.